Reconvened on March 4, 1999 at 10:23 a.m.

Jordahl: Mike Singer here from the City of Tiffin, their City Engineer. Also, Glen Potter, the Mayor.

Tiffin City Planner Mike Singer: City Planner.

Jordahl: City Planner.

Singer: I've got some information for you on the annexation policies in Tiffin. There's a map on the back which shows the annexation history. I'd like to start off with just a couple of quick comments if I could. First of all, we'd like to thank you for your imperious summons to come and explain our policy (inaudible). Here's a map. This opportunity to speak to you during the work day. Glen, I think, has a (inaudible) for you to fill out at the end of the day. And if anybody has any questions about what Tiffin's doing, we have standing City Council meetings the 2nd Wednesday of the month, 6:30. Everybody's invited. I was a little curious to see the County's interpretation of Tiffin's annexation policies in the paper yesterday. They didn't seem to match exactly with what information we know to be true about how the City of Tiffin has grown and why. This seems to be a pretty good forum for us to explain what has happened, why it has happened and what will happen next. The City of Tiffin has had a concrete policy of trying to isolate itself in terms of maintaining its separate identity from Coralville. Coralville's rapid expansion on its western side has led the Planning and Zoning Commission and the Tiffin City Council to develop a land use plan that would maintain an area of separation between western Coralville and eastern Tiffin. This was first documented in their 1992 Land Use Plan. This is not a recent action by the City; however, as the city has grown and as it has more financial resources, as it has learned more about the planning and growth process it has been able to formulate a more coherent policy in terms of trying to implement and achieve its land use policies. Its goal, quite frankly, is to assure for a variety of land uses within their community and to maintain a separate identity from Coralville. Totally explicit. I don't think anybody here has any doubts about what the City's policy is or why we've taken certain actions. Specifically, the City of Tiffin's justifications for annexations have been to adhere to the wishes of the property owners. Every annexation that has occurred has been a voluntary annexation. In many cases the Tiffin City Council or the Tiffin Planning and Zoning Commissions have gone and met with property owners, discussed their options, informed them of the City's goals and activities of the City's intentions or lack of intentions to improve or extend services. In each of those cases those persons, those property owners have voluntarily chosen to come into the City of Tiffin. Many of those property owners had several choices, as you can look on the map and you look up in the far northeastern part of Tiffin. North Liberty's right up there; Coralville's right up there; remaining in Johnson County remained an option for them. But in each of those instances they chose to come into the City of Tiffin. They each have individual reasons why they chose to come into Tiffin. But they did. And it was voluntary. And I can tell you that since 1993 there have been no involuntary annexations. There's never been an involuntary annexation in the history of Tiffin. And there are no non-consenting annexations. We actually anticipated one small one and a half acre track on non-consenting voluntary annexation into the City of Tiffin in our most recent round of annexation. But quite frankly last night in kind of a remarkable act of negotiations on behalf of the City, the property owner and the City reached an understanding that made it desirable for that person to voluntarily annex into the City. This is Mr. Thompson who is on the far east side (inaudible). In each case the City either negotiates or explains or describes what their activities are. In each case those people choose to voluntarily annex into the City. It's quite certainly not with a gun to their head. In every case it's a clear choice on their part. Your concerns obviously are about the eroding amount of Johnson County jurisdiction and the increasing amount of Tiffin property. One of the explanations that I read about was that it was reactionary, that it's a quid pro quo, that it's a land race to include properties into the City of Tiffin. I'm here to tell you that that's not true. Yes, it is a clear cut policy to go ahead and make sure that it can control land uses that are key and vital to itself. But it is not necessarily in competition. In fact, there was most recently a month and a half ago, an unavoidable competition for some 35 acres of land owned by the Raricks in the far northeast part of Tiffin. Because the City of Tiffin was clarifying its boundaries with Coralville for purposes of having absolutely contiguous properties between Tiffin and Coralville, an island would have been created and there was 35 acres of the Rarick property that would have been a Johnson County. State law prohibits islands to be created through the annexation process. So the City took the steps to begin the non-consenting annexation process. This is were smaller chunks of land that would have been islands can be brought in through the voluntary annexation process. After duly notifying all the agencies and taxing parties and neighboring communities, we found out that the Raricks really wanted to be in Coralville and not in Tiffin. And if you look at what would have been otherwise a very clean boundary line which would have been Interstate 380 up to Forever Green Road, actually has a bit of a jog in it and that is because the City of Tiffin acquiesced to the wishes of the property and did not contest their annexation when in fact perhaps their land use policies, their overall goals and the definition of City boundaries probably would have been cleaner if they had stuck to their guns perhaps is a way to put it. But that wasn't the case and that's not the will of the Tiffin City Council. Tiffin has demonstrated good neighborliness in this matter no matter what you may have heard. The City of Tiffin will continue its investment policy. It is undergoing a million dollar waste water treatment facility which will increase its potential capacity to a population of 3,000 people. The little Tiffin that we all remember of 1993-1994 of 450 souls is now 900 people. The City's budget is close to doubling. The areas that are necessary for (inaudible) in terms of road control, land use control, regulatory issues, sewer and water extensions they've all doubled. The City is not undertaking these changes I think lightly. They have committed to growth, but controlled growth. Their land use policies called for high-density, urban style development centered around the core of the existing part of the community. They limit, in fact actually have prohibitions on leap frog type development expansions out in wings and fingers going out into undeveloped portions and they have explicitly stated their intentions along Jasper Avenue in the eastern part of Tiffin. This was the same issue that came up before the City Development Board last month. There was a request by the City Development Board to explain the most recent annexation up in the northeast part. And at that time the City of Tiffin explained that it has no intention of improving services up in that area. Yes they will assume all financial responsibility for roads within their control. They'll assume all the regulatory and (inaudible) process that fall into this area. But the extension of sewer and water, the improvements of lands, the encouragement of some type of large scale developments or research parks or commercial strips or whatever, no that' not going to happen, at least that's not going to happen under the current land use policies. So it is explicit. It's long-standing. We think it's very clear if anybody cares to find out from us what's going on. And we think that it is actually a model that could be considered by other communities. Do what you can do well. Do it in a high density pattern which cuts down the municipal infrastructure costs. Try and maintain a unique and separate identity. Tiffin, I think as you can all appreciate, could in fact become one of the real jewels of Johnson County. It has a unique character. It has an ideal location. It has a really wonderful set of opportunities before it. But it could blow it. It could blow it, it could look like hell. It could just be all strewn out. It could have messed up land use policies. It could have no infrastructure or recreational services. But the City's got a solid base of planning to support these activities. Again, anybody that might think that it's reactionary or that it's sudden or that it's anticipatory of other people's actions, that's not the whole story. I've listed out here some of the planning efforts that the City of Tiffin has taken over the last (inaudible) years. And in each case there is an annexation policy that is described in each of these planning documents. And in each case it states that annexation would occur to the east of the existing part to Tiffin up to and touching Coralville. Even most recently the 1997 Fringe Area Agreement with Johnson County identifies these area 2, which was this high growth area and under the line of annexation it says annexation was highly likely. When, why and under what conditions annexation would occur nobody can always predict that. And there will be further annexations. The property that is showing in the map for 1999 the request for voluntary annexations are in fact at the City Attorney's office right now; they will be formulated and presented to the City Council next Wednesday on the 10th and those will go directly to the City Development Board. We are here to tell you that we intend to annex that 67 acres. If further annexations come up in the short term, we will come to you in this fashion and we will tell you before you read about it. I think that the other concern that you have is what's going to happen with the roads that are now totally within the City of Tiffin. And the answer to that I think Glen and I talked about this a little bit, it's whatever you want. We will maintain them as you direct. Our suggestion of course has been that for cost effective reasons we think that it may still be useful for the County to actually implement the maintenance of those roads and we would reimburse them. If that's not suitable with you, then provide us with an alternative that you think is better suited. If you want to have nothing to do, your trucks are going all the way through that road from the south to the north, north to the south, if you want to pull up the blade, and keep going and then set the blade down on the other side of what will soon be Tiffin, that's fine. We can do that. If you want to keep going through, then let's figure out as cost per mile, cost per foot, cost per ton, and you bill us. We'll pay you. You obviously have the largest stock of vehicles to do this. You're fleet and maintenance costs are already established, whether you set that blade down or not. We would prefer to reimburse you than we would to try to invest in stock ourselves and go ahead and do it. But so be it. You let us know what you want to do. I think the Mayor has already had discussions with the Secondary Roads and whatever can be worked out to the advantage of both parties, I think we should just go ahead and do that. So in summary, I guess I would say let us know what your concerns are. Let us know in advance or include us in your initial discussions so we know what you're thinking and what your concerns are. We'd be happy to come or you're always welcome to come to a Tiffin City Council Meeting. I think that between the 2 of us we could probably work out a suitable land use policy for that area. Glen, I don't know if you've got anything you want to say.

Potter: There's not a whole hell of a lot left, I don't think Mike. This annexation in 99 that we have down there, actually Tiffin has purchased that. We have a 2 year lease on that with an option to purchase. That will be turned into... for recreation, for ball fields and stuff like that. Maybe some time in the future, there'll be a grade school down in there. But that's the main reason we picked up this property down there. That gives us both sides of the railroad track and we also have a large park down there now that we have a sewer plant on. There's a possibility of more park on down there in the future. Like Mike said, everything had been planned for years and years before we ever had the first subdivision in Tiffin. You knew what was going to happen, everything was planned out. He's a super planner and one of the better Planning and Zoning Commissions in the county, maybe in the state. We thank you very much for listening to us.

Stutsman: Well I regret, Mike, that you thought that this was an imperial command performance. I think we're interested in communication and we're interested in planning. We're interested in doing our jobs. This came forth to us as a sizable annexation, 1,000 acres. So it was just logical that we had some concerns and wanted to address some of those concerns and to hear what your plans are. I didn't know this was on Tiffin's City Council Meetings. We don't get regular announcements of those meetings so we thought this was probably the best vehicle to do this, to have this open discussion, so we can feel we know what's going on and can address what's happening on some areas that we've had responsibility for. The main concern was in the area of the roads. We haven't entered into those discussions before about a City taking over an area and the County having a contract. It was just logical that we wanted to have some visit with that. I'm sorry, Glen, that you had to take off work to do this. Maybe we could have arranged for another time that you could have come in.

Potter: I doubt very much they even miss me.

Stutsman: OK, all right. I just wanted to... I think communication between the towns and the County and communities is good.

Singer: Let me pull that knife just a little farther out of your back then. We do have a very good working relationship with the County. I think our Fringe Area Agreement is excellent. I think working with Rick and R.J. and the Board of Supervisors is really, really good. You know we're a little ticklish about annexations because we've had problems with Coralville . There's no doubt about that. But in this matter, I think we just want to make sure that the record is clear.

Jordahl: The Planning and Zoning Director Rick Dvorak sent a letter a month ago, Rick, something like that, raising this question of the road. That was really the only interest or involvement that I personally had with this question because it involves the inclusion of the a significant portion of Jasper Avenue. It's something that I need to dance around talking about too much because of addresses on that road. But it's a question that, in terms of the maintenance responsibilities of the Secondary Roads Department, was a question that we needed to get clarified. I had not heard back in response to Rick's letter. I don't believe that Secondary Roads has, but I'm not sure about how or when that occurred relative to getting this on the agenda here. To me it was this road question we needed to get cleared up.

Potter: I think the only communication we had was I called Secondary Roads Department and we visited and that was about it. We knew we had something to work out.

Jordahl: So maybe we could get Rick or Al and Kevin to address the road question. Janet, I know Pat had said something about the legal nature of whether we can even maintain a road within the corporate boundaries of the city when he was here the other day. I don't know if you recall it or are even aware of it. I assume... I know, Al, you said maybe you weren't here when Pat said that either. It may be that we'll still have something to work out on Pat's legal judgement on the matter. Where are we at as of now?

Potter: Well half of Jasper Avenue you've been maintaining for us anyway. But now we have the whole Jasper Avenue.

Singer: On the north part.

Potter: On the north part. We still share half of it on the south part.

Jordahl: Uh-huh.

Potter: But we inherited almost a mile, would you said.

Miller: It's over a mile (inaudible).

Potter: That's right. We want to just do whatever we can. We just don't want to go out there ourselves. These gentleman have been doing a beautiful job as long as I can remember. We have good equipment, all new equipment, but we'd just as soon not wear it out on Jasper Avenue when they're going up and down the road anyway.

Singer: If it's a question of... I think we have to maybe be flexible in this matter. If the County has concerns about liability issues than maybe that what that requires is the City to provide a waiver of liability or some type of insurance certificate for those portions. If it's a matter of being assured of reimbursement from the City then let us bond for that perhaps, or let us have a standing deposit into an account so it's always drawing down as required. Let us pay in advance. Let us try and come up with something. But there's not doubt in my mind, and I don't think there's any in the Planning and Zoning Commission or of the Council that it is more cost effective for the County to continue on that road than it is for Tiffin to go out and maintain that road individually, that stretch. If somebody can prove that that's not the case, that there is some difference in that economy of scale , then that's fine, we'll do it. Our interest is it keep our costs down, just like yours is. But if you have a cost per mile, than let us pay that cost per mile at 100%, or 125% or whatever it takes. It probably would be less expensive than doing it ourselves. You're also going to get to that issue in the very last (inaudible) quarter section of Jasper where it's split between Coralville and Tiffin because of this acquiescence on the non-consenting annexation. That last (inaudible) quarter section, 1300 feet south of Forever Green, may be a 3 party agreement with some type of funding level. I don't know that Coralville is excited about going out and maintaining half a road for 1000 feet. I just don't know but whatever it takes. If you guys are willing to be a little bit flexible and you want some cash up front and you want an assurance or get into a 2 year agreement, let's try it for 6 months. Let's see what happens.

Stutsman: Kevin, do you have any comments about the proposals?

Kevin Hackathorn: Yes, where we used to take care of Jasper Avenue, from this 95 annexation, when you're coming down the road there's no really good place to turn around so we just made the agreement we'll go down to Highway 6 and turn around because there's no easy place to turn around. Well now that you're going all the way up to Forever Green, we have an intersection where we can turn around and, not only is it easy to say that yes, our equipment is going over it and drop the blade, but there's a lot of other headaches that go along with a gravel road. For instance, on that Jasper Avenue, I know we had a schedule. We were going to do some ditch cleaning this summer on it. There's brush control and things like that. Like you said, when you get up there, the billing would be split there into Coralville and Tiffin.

Singer: Yes, it would be (inaudible).

Hackathorn: We've already denied Coralville the (inaudible) on Oakdale Road up there. They want us to do the same thing and we said no. We've done that with several other towns. Unless we have... a lot of them we'll have a trade off. We'll take care of this mile but you take care of this mile. For instance, Deer Creek Road, I don't know if you know where that is, over by the quarry, we do a mile of that for Iowa City. In turn, they so Sycamore Hill down there for us and part of the Sand Route. It's kind of a... it makes maintenance easier for us.

Singer: That's true. I hadn't thought about that.

Duffy: Jonathan?

Jordahl: Yes, Charlie?

Duffy: Yes, I was out there the other day and drove around the proposed annexations, I'm glad you said voluntary annexations. The green area... did you already comment on the east?

Singer: Uh-huh.

Duffy: That was voluntary too, the green area? As far as roads are concerned, Shueyville has brought this up several times. You're probably familiar with that, Mike. I've known Mike and Glen for years. The Supervisors, in the past, said no, once it's annexed, it's the City's. So if we start doing one road for Tiffin, it is a nice place, Tiffin is, then we probably have to do it for... I'm sure if I were on the Shueyville City Council, I'd be down here within a few days to ask if we could have an agreement with... they've asked several times but once it's annexed, then it isn't County property anymore. Well maybe somebody would argue that because Tiffin is in the county but I think our hands are probably tied here plus the liability was one thing that was brought up. If there's another way to do it, then I would say you better do your own thing. Do you get any State funding from the gas tax? You probably get some.

Singer: We get road use tax.

Duffy: Yes, for road use tax dollars. If I remember right, a few years back the county was percentage-wise really getting more but then they kind of lowered our percentage and gave it to the Cities. That would probably be the way to handle that.

Singer: I don't think anybody here, I don't think we would propose anything about having you just do it at cost. Perhaps, those have been the proposals from Shueyville or Coralville or other communities in the past, but if you'd maybe consider a contracted service where there's cost plus paid to the County for those services. It may still work out being cheaper than the City of Tiffin doing it. So it would actually be a contracted service where you'd have your cost plus there'd be some additional payment on top of that. We'd have to see what the numbers were. I don't even know if you'd want to consider that but it would be a minor revenue generator for the County.

Lehman: I think Mike... he's offered us some options. I don't know if we're prepared to do anything today but I think we need some discussion and maybe some costs. We've got the legal end of it to look at too. Where are we at today? Say we had a snowfall, whose maintaining that?

Hackathorn: We are, as far as I know, up to the 11th of this month. When we're...

Lehman: OK, we're concerned about the residents out there. Not that anyone wants to abandon them but we're concerned about that.

Jordahl: Least of all me.

Lehman: I think Mike's presented some options to us that we can pursue from here.

Singer: Well if they don't work out, we don't want to gum up the Secondary Roads' scheduling out there. That's not the issue. We'd rather get along than...

Stutsman: Let me... This annexation is to be final March 11th. Is that correct?

Potter: Right.

Stutsman: OK. So none of these details with Secondary Roads have been worked out.

Singer: The actual annexation for the northeastern part marked 1998 is effective in about 10 days, I think. That's simply the end of the 30 day review period for the City Development Board. It will be probably a couple weeks after that or towards the end of March before both the County and the City get official notification that that process went through. There's always delays coming out of Des Moines for annexation notices. The final annexation... The item that's shown in 1999 will be presented for consideration by the City Council on March 10th. That actual annexation of those properties probably won't be completed and totally in effect until April, perhaps early May. That's just because of the several month process that goes through.

Lehman: Are you thinking that maybe we need some type of temporary agreement here for a month or 2 until we get things worked out?

Singer: I don't think we're in a position to ask you guys to make a decision shortly. I think we've got a couple of... a week or so to get something drafted out.

Stutsman: I'm thinking about the residents in that area. Who has responsibility if we have a snow storm? Who's going to clear it?

Lehman: Liability might be connected with it, but it could be a chance happening.

Hackathorn: Yes, if they get a storm out there or something, we'll make it go away. That's not a problem. (Inaudible).

Jordahl: Al?

Miller: Yes. I haven't been involved in all the conversations but I was kind of updated by Mike before he went on vacation. I know that Mike had talked to Tiffin previously. I don't know how long ago it was.

Stutsman: Mike Gardner?

Miller: Gardner, yes.

Stutsman: OK.

Miller: His decision at that time was that we had no desire to take on any maintenance responsibilities north of Highway 6. This section south of 6 up to the railroad tracks was the same kind of situation that Kevin was talking about. We don't have a good place... we can't turn our trucks around and we have to go up the road anyway to Highway 6. As far as Mike was concerned and Kevin was concerned, the answer from our department was we don't want any part of that stretch north of Highway 6. I think we need to be consistent in how we make our decisions on these things because we can reconsider and take a look at what we're going to do here but it's going to open it up to Coralville and every other...

Stutsman: And Shueyville...

Miller: ...and Shueyville and everybody else. I guess just to make a statement on Mike's behalf, we told Tiffin we didn't want this. Today, it seems like we're being asked do you really mean no. As far as our department is concerned, I think we really do mean no.

Jordahl: Uh-huh.

Miller: Part of the decision is in your hands also. That's kind of where we stand.

Stutsman: Uh-huh.

Jordahl: Uh-huh.

Singer: I think we are aware of Glen and Mike Gardner's conversation about that and that's fine. I don't know exactly what the consideration was in terms of the cost of the County or the responsibilities of the County. If that in fact is the standing policy of the County, we'll live with that and live under it. There's no problem. We'll just move on from there. If there is an option where there could be a cost plus benefit payment to the County and some sort of limitation of liability that would set this proposal apart from the other ones that you're dealing with other communities, that would separate it and maybe even establish a different option for the County, and you feel like you want to explore that, we'd be happy to do that. But I think as of the 12:01 on the 11th of 1999, City of Tiffin would have to assume all responsibility for those stretches of road that are under their control unless we could work out something at a later date, or up until that time that any other agreement is reached.

Jordahl: An item that isn't specifically on the agenda under annexation, but it included within the 1999 proposed annexations and purchases that Pole Barn, Glen, that you and I had talked about over the phone the other month. I don't know what role that facility might play in a negotiations. We talked about an interest on the City's part on doing some trading with property that the Secondary Roads has inside of Tiffin and there's also the question where we're going to locate an ambulance if we move out of Coralville's fire station. It might be as discussions go forward with Secondary Roads, that'd be something to include in the conversation.

Potter: All right. That Pole Building... we're not sure about that yet, whether we own that or not. We don't own it.

Dvorak: In some research I did recently with Mike's help, as of the 2nd or 3rd of this month, that property contract was written, it's not the same person I thought the City was working with on the remainder of that property. It has a chance for ownership. In that document, I had a very time finding that it was recorded. But it has been recorded.

Jordahl: So the City has ownership?

Dvorak: (Inaudible) we're building property (inaudible).

Singer: No, no.

Jordahl: The City does not have ownership.

Singer: No. There are 67 acres in the annexation, or 68 acres. One is Mr. Thompson's property on the far west of the area and then that green building is a 2 acre component to the 67 acres, which is not part of the City's lease for the property. The remaining 65 acres are being leased by the City of Tiffin, soon to be acquired by the City of Tiffin, and will be future development sites for recreation and we hope an elementary school or junior high school will open up locations out there.

Jordahl: Uh-huh.

Singer: It's almost going to be all green, we believe.

Dvorak: Well in light of that, Mike, if the owner of that (inaudible) doesn't want to voluntarily annex, I don't know the status of that.

Singer: We have a voluntary annexation request from them.

Dvorak: Oh they are now, OK.

Singer: Yes, yes. All property owners. There's 3 property owners out there and all 3, including Mr. Thompson, have requested voluntary annexation. (Inaudible).

Dvorak: The other question I had was the Board has worked with some other agencies. I know Jonathan has too in the Clear Creek Watershed. I understand there maybe some development in that area. In Mike Singer's words, it's pretty much all flood plain down through there so I think our Fringe Area Agreement discusses the notification of that. I guess I'm bringing this up for the Board's interests, especially if you would get some calls, that area is currently under our jurisdiction, will be now under the City's jurisdiction. But we do have an agreement that any development, a flood plain development, in that area, we are to notify them and they are to notify us. So if in the future, if you do get calls about schools or playgrounds or whatever, they do have to notify us. I'm sure Mike, at that time, will come back to the Board and discuss those things that may come up in that area because that watershed has been studied frequently and it is something fairly fragile in that area.

Jordahl: And fairly wet. OK. Is there any other discussion, questions that members of the public would like to ask, Board members? Anything else people would like to say?

Stutsman: I would like to ask for future planning in my mind. What's the plans for this area, this 1995 and 1998? You talk about keeping that as a green belt, I'm thinking about what kind of demands are going to be put on the County as far as Sheriff and Ambulance service if this whole area would develop.

Singer: Well, to answer your question, all of it comes under the Tiffin Fire District and Tiffin Association. All of the law enforcement that would occur within that area would be contracted through the City of Tiffin. Because it's all within the city limits, even though it may be sparsely developed it's still within the city limits. This has to be considered as part of the area of coverage that would be contracted between the city of Tiffin and the Johnson County Sheriff's Department. In terms of utility improvements or anything else like that as we said we're not anticipating anything. The easterly most 2 quarter quarter sections that are out there are designated on the future land use map as agricultural and they do allow for low density residential, very low density residential, comparable to RS 5 cluster or something, RS 10, something along those lines it would allow for that. We feel uncomfortable saying categorically it must be exclusively agricultural. We think we could get into some hot water there. But the property owners that agreed to the voluntary annexations in those areas were very much interested in maintaining agricultural uses out there. So we're in sync with the property owners at this point. What happens with their kids and their kids after that is a different issue. The areas that are along Highway 6 that are most close to the existing development area. When you see the word Tiffin down there in the 1994 section there is a stretch which probably will see additional commercial high-density residential and single family home construction on either side. More to the north than to the south, just because it's so wet down there. But that has an explicit end to it. It's halfway between where Tiffin is now and where the easterly city limits are which is right under the Interstate 380 bridge now. That's where Tiffin begins.

Jordahl: Speaking of the Interstate 380 bridge, having looked both at this map and at Coralville's map of their proposed development abutting the other side of Interstate 380, your 1995 annexation there includes a little farmstead residence relatively newer or at least improved house that seems to lie right in the path of this proposed interstate exchange. Do you care to comment on that?

Singer: That's the (inaudible) property. City has sent a letter to Iowa Department of Transportation, Johnson County Board of Supervisors, Johnson County Council of Governments, and just about anybody else that will listen that Tiffin is not crazy at all about seeing an interstate exchange there. We don't understand why an interstate exchange would be located at a point where there's flood plain, creek, railroad crossing, and highway crossing located 3/4 of a mile from another interstate exchange. We may be simple country folk, but we don't quite get that one. The other options of creating an extension of Oakdale Boulevard which would cross interstate 380 and would smack into the middle of this eastern Tiffin area that's not a great idea from our perspective either because it just places additional demands on property owners and their kids to consider cashing in for development and creating more of this amorphous commercial strip development, which is exactly what we want to avoid. Realistically, Forever Green Road has the greatest ability to serve the greatest number of communities. It's in a clean flat stretch, it's in an existing road, it would serve North Liberty, Coralville and Tiffin. It seems to make a lot more sense to have something up there. That's something that in terms of land use development practices we could probably handle. But anything south of that we're against it. Especially the idea of having half of it in Tiffin when we don't really want it.

Potter: We have an account (inaudible). 5,000 cars to Tiffin a day. And with this new intersection of 6 on 380 I couldn't imagine what it would be then. It's nice to keep them out of town.

Duffy: I think you're going to have quite a fuse. They come in from the west to get to the mall. From the Amana Colonies. I did hear yesterday talking with some representatives from DOT that and you probably know it, there will be more lanes on the 380-80 interchange. In fact they told me that it'd be in the future to add at least a couple more around that vicinity. I don't know which side of the highway they're going to put them on. I'd say probably the north. But I understand, you want your own identity and I like that. And I'm sure there's people that like to come to Tiffin and got a lot of things going for you, I'm sure of that.

Jordahl: The arterial streets planning business Oakdale Boulevard, I suppose Johnson County Council of Governments would be a better forum for that one since at this point you're talking about Tiffin and Coralville and we're not really at the table on that one. I think we've probably exhausted the topic from Johnson County's point of view. We'll have to hear I think maybe from Pat White. But we certainly have already from the Secondary Roads Department about their position on this. Whether a cost plus contract would be an option to pursue or not I think is going to be to some extent up to the County Attorney. But we also will take very seriously the recommendation of our Secondary Roads Department engineers.

Singer: Whatever they consider to be the best is what we'll follow.

Jordahl: Thank you very much for coming in.

Singer: Thank you. We appreciate your time.

(Continued in Part 6)